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Distance_Guru · Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2002 8:16 am Post subject:

That's interesting. We'll have to keep an eye on the CU women and see if they continue the very high level of performance that they've maintained over the past few years.
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Time is the fire in which we burn

Conway · Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2002 1:05 pm Post subject:

So back to topic ... Where will america's young talent go to be developed ??? In the sprints there are numerous places a young person can go .. TCU, Florida, Tennessee, South Carolina, Baylor are just a few that quickly come to mid ... That does not take into account a number of div II schools as well as many community colleges ...

What does a yooung half miler or miler do ??? And as much as everyone likes CU they can only handle so many young people .. It seems to me that as much as anything else, lack of available quality trianing alternatives is a reason for lack of quality middle distance and distance athletes in the country ...

Dan · Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2002 1:11 pm Post subject:

Conway · Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2002 2:01 pm Post subject:

Hmmm ... While I agree in part It's not like the kids coming out have NO potential ... They are suffering from a lot of different maladies (many of which we have discussed) they still have potential ... Kids are still coming out around say 4:07 - 4:13 (just to use a range) .. and history has shown us that those people can become sub 4:00 milers ... Or outstanding 5K and 10K runners ...

Knowing that, why aern't we developing them ... As I have thought about it I see it almost the same way as I do teaching in general ... School teachers say they can't teach cause the parents didn't prepare them ... And college coaches say they can't coach because the high school coaches didn't prepare them ... Well isn't that the nature of the beast in both cases ??? Isn't the job of a coach to teach ??? I mean I would feel differently if all that was graduating from high school each year were 4:25 kids, but we are only talking about 4 or 5 seconds difference betweem the "golden age" of high school and current kids ... Now on the track in a race thta is a large margin ... But I would think that in terms of training and development its enough to work with ... Maybe even better in some ways ...

Sooo ... Are you guys telling me tht there are only 3 schools a kid can go to in this country and get "adequate" or better instruciton on middle distance running ????

Dan · Posted: Thu Jun 20, 2002 2:05 pm Post subject:

Distance_Guru · Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2002 8:51 am Post subject:

Dan · Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2002 9:27 am Post subject:

I'll have to keep an eye on New Mexico. They do have one advantage in that virtually no one recruits in their state... Wink

Distance_Guru · Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2002 9:38 am Post subject:

Of coarse there's a reason no one else recruits out of New Mexico, the track and field times compaired to other state usually aren't very good. I'm a prime example I ran the 3200 in 10:07 as a Senior, I was the third fastest senior in NM that year! Of coarse the altitude dosen't help times for guys I usually say take 5 seconds off a 1600 and 10 off a 3200 even so having a 9:57 as one of the top times isn't good. The only D1 school that regularly recruits athletes from NM is you guessed it CU. Ron Roybal and Matt Napier both of whom were mentioned in Running With the Buffaloes are New Mexico kids. Other than that the only D1 school that I can think of that has recruited more than one New Mexico kid is Northern Arizona.

That's interesting about Portland. I'm not proud of it but I used to post on Dyestat every once in a while Sad

and the buz there was that Portland was really well coached. Of coarse that's what I get for listening to a bounch of high school and D3 kids from back east.
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Time is the fire in which we burn

Dan · Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2002 10:20 am Post subject:

Dyestat has a lot of good stuff to offer and an active forum (not an atmosphere that I care for, though), so I won't hold that against you. Smile

I sort of know the UP coach, so I ought to be careful what I say... Many of the top runners there actually coach themselves, from firsthand accounts. So, maybe it's true that the team is really well coached. Wink

Dan

Micah Ward · Posted: Sat Jun 22, 2002 7:16 pm Post subject:

It is interesting that you mention New Mexico. That is where Ann Trason started college. She was recruited but only stayed her freshman year I believe.

You just never know where I will work in a mention of the Ultragoddess. Very Happy

Conway · Posted: Sun Jun 23, 2002 7:55 am Post subject:

I'm aware of New Mexico but they haven't turned out anyone yet in either the 800 or 1500 ... my question is where can akid go right now to develop in those events ???? And I reallly see no where other than maybe Georgetown, Stanford and Arkansas ....

I do wish that USATF would get together withthe better coaches in the country and try to work out some type of training system where the best could work with the best !!!! John Smith with the top spritners and Gags with the top middle distance ... Venegas with the weight people ... Etc ... Something ont he lines of a true "national" program ... Maybe workouts by mail or email along with some periodic in person visits ... At least for those who don't or can't live in the area of the coach ...

I just feel thatit is not lack of talnet in this country in some events, but rather lack of proper training and training opportunitites ... Oh well ... What do I know ... Rolling Eyes

Distance_Guru · Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2002 9:32 am Post subject:

With all this talk of the US being horrible in middle distance and Europeans being pretty good I decided to do a little research. Since 1990 I looked up all the athletes that finished the season with one of the 10 best times in the world. We actually compaired alright with every country except Spain. I also checked up on New Zeland, they had a grand total of 0.

USA = 7

Denmark =1
Germany=3
France=6
England=5
Ireland=1
Italy=1
Spain=14

So really with the exception of Spain we compair pretty well. Great Britan, Ireland, Denmark and Italy have only had one more top 10, 1500 runner than us since 1990.

On a side note, Spainish people still have a much larger amount of their gene pool that originated in north Africa, I wonder if that might make an arguement for the genetics of running fast.

EDIT: Fixed typo
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Time is the fire in which we burn

Dan · Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2002 9:53 am Post subject:

Nice to see some solid data entering these discussions. Smile

I wonder if the WC/OG performances would show the same thing as the top times? Seems the Americans get worse than their seed times in the big meets whereas the better Europeans have a good grasp on how to race and play the role of spoilers.

New Zealand hasn't produced squat in several decades... Rod Dixon was the last notable Kiwi that I can think of.

Going beyond just the numbers you presented, the picture probably doesn't look quite as rosy when considering population size. Also, other than possibly France, I would guess the US' top-10'ers over the past 10 years have a much stronger international flavor.

Dan

Distance_Guru · Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2002 10:01 am Post subject:

Joe Falcon, Jim Spivey and Steve Holaman. Were the three that got the top 10's for the US, I could be wrong but I think they are all American-Americans (please pardon the termanology, but I couldn't think of another way to put it)
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Time is the fire in which we burn

Dan · Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2002 10:17 am Post subject:

What about Meb, Khannouchi, Plaatjes, and I'm sure several others if I were to tax my memory further...? Sydney Maree didn't compete after 1990, did he (I'm thinking more like '85)?

Dan

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