Run-Down Forums

Conway · Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2001 6:45 pm Post subject:

Track and Field does its annual rankings at the end of each season .. Perhaps Run-Down can do its own rankings .. So who would you out there rank as the top athletes for this past season .. And I will not start the conversation this time .. I will let others state their opinions first Smile

Dan · Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2001 8:16 pm Post subject:

Hmm, that's a pretty cool idea. The Annual Run-Down! Has a nice ring to it. Smile

Of course, it also sounds like a lot of work... Could be a good collaborative effort -- let everyone chime in on the event(s) that interest them and see if we can come to some sort of a consensus.

3 deep or 10?

Dan

Conway · Posted: Tue Sep 18, 2001 9:00 pm Post subject:

That's kind of what I had in mind .. But it will take some participation from the rest of the folks .. I was thinikin maybe 5 deep .. 3 seems to leave an event just short, but 10 might be asking too much ... Unless of course there is a lot of participation .. But coudl be lots of fun .. Anyone else game ??

Micah Ward · Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2001 6:31 pm Post subject:

OK guys I will start by admitting that I am more of a casual fan compared to you two but I am willing to throw in my two cents worth (as if you hadn't noticed). Of course, sometimes my opinion isn't worth the full two cents, but I would go with 5 deep.

Conway · Posted: Wed Sep 19, 2001 6:53 pm Post subject:

Ok .. 3's a crowd so lets get started Smile

.. And we'll hope that others join in .. What do you say Dan ?? What event should we tackle first ?? Or do you want to try to tackle the overall list first and then work on individual events ??

Micah Ward · Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2001 8:03 am Post subject:

Casual fan goes first. In the 100 I would say Maurice Green would be on top but I get real casual after that. Will Marion be on the top after getting beat by Block at Worlds? If so then doesn't Block have a strong case for second? I'm not familiar with how well she did on the Grand Prix circuit. Help me out guys.

Leechboy, where you been lately? Shaun and Graeme, you guys running cross country? If so, how are you doing? My daughter has started her sophomore season at college in a less than auspiciuos manner but the season is young and her training is going well.

Dan · Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2001 9:23 am Post subject:

The ball is now rolling... No question that Maurice is number one. Even his short, "up and down" season was convincingly dominating. Even though Pintussevich-Block won the biggest race (or so we're told; that subsequent series of "championship" races makes it dubitable...), I don't think there can be any question that Marion had the better overall season. Zhana had a lot of 3rd's and 4th's throughout the season, and little of note other than the two big Edmonton races. Still, I'm inclined to agree that she deserves #2, as no one else really stood out.

I'll need to see some year end performance lists before I can be too comfortable ranking the events...

Yeah, I've also been wondering what happened to Leech Boy, Grame, Shaun, Robert, and Michael (MJSbossman)...

Dan

Conway · Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2001 6:10 pm Post subject:

Well it looks like we are unanimous for number one's .. Greene only had one loss all year and that was in Oregon in a race that was clearly a false start .. Marion of course had her loss in the wrong meet, but won everything else ..

Number 2's are both easy and difficult .. For the men Montgomery won everything that Mo didn't .. And put together an impressive season .. On the women's side no one was number 2 consistently .. But I would say that P-Block's overall season PLUS her big win over Marion should give her the number 2 slot ..

Number 3 on the men's side I think is again an easy one .. Bernard Williams finished high on a consistent basis, got the bronze in Edmonton, and easily had the third best set of marks .. For the women in an up and down year for most sprinters I'm inclined to give the nod to Thanou .. Solid third at Worlds and ran well when she did run in Europe .. The hard part about ranking Thanou year in and year out is that she competes sparingly outside her country and tends to try to save it all for the year's big meet ..

4th and 5th for the men I would say Boldon and Chambers .. Both on basis of placemnt at Worlds and the fact that Boldon had the more impressive set of marks and tended to finish only behind those ranked ahead of him ..

4th and 5th for the women I would say Sturrup then Gaines based on World placement and Sturrup generally placing better in European meets ..

And I would love for some of the others to join in .. But til then back to you gentlemen ... Smile

Dan · Posted: Sat Sep 22, 2001 10:41 pm Post subject:

I definitely agree with Montgomery for #2, seeing as how he's the only athlete that one could even *attempt* to make a case for as #1. Of course, Maurice tends to make that a moot point. Smile

I'd be inclined to agree wtih Thanau and Bernard as #3's, but Bernard isn't quite convincing enough in that spot. I just can't think of anyone more deserving... 4 and 5 sound solid. I'm wavering on whether to swap Ato and Bernard, though.

Looking at the 200, I think Kederis has to be given the respect for a change, especially considering the rest of the 200 field was so weak. For that very reason, I'm going to take a rather shaky stand and rate JJ Johnson #2. In the absence of any good marks or notable consistency, one good performance seems to be just enough criteria. Heck, one performance is basically what gets Kederis the top spot the past two years... Smile

Not much consistency of top marks, but that's not exactly news in the 200 right now. I'd have to resort to the lists on 4 and 5, as nothing else about the performances seems to have enough merit to judge on. Let's say Christian Malcom at #4 and a very shaky Christopher Williams for #5. (Interesting that Shawn Crawford is ranked #1 by the points system.)

For the women, Marion again is the clear choice for #1, even with some rather uninspired/uninspiring racing. Close call between Debbie Ferguson and Kelli White, but I think I'll have to give the nod to Ferguson. LaTasha Jenkins had enough top marks to take #4, and #5 has me scrambling a bit... Juliet Campbell is ranked highly, but is nowhere to be seen in terms of times. Is Edmonton really worth that much? Although she's not all that high on the list, I think I'll go with Beverly McDonald, and I'll re-read this in the morning to see if it made any sense... Smile

Here are some links that might aid the discussion:

IAAF Rankings
IAAF Top Lists

Dan

Conway · Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2001 9:01 am Post subject:

Let's see the 200 meters .. First off I have to say I think you are looking at the right set of people - except for JJ .. I think the top 5 (in no order yet) would be Crawford, Kederis, Williams, Williams, Malcolm and maybe Clay .. I have a hard time considering JJ becasue he did nothing outside of one race ... And on that note I have a hard time with KEderis because he is basically in the same boat .. With one exception .. His race contained all of the notables except for Clay (who was leading the world coming in)and he beat them all .. So on that note Kederis gets #1 .. For the women simple choce for Marion as she beat everyone and won the big race even though it was the worst year in the event since somewhere in the 70's ...

Number 2's ... Gets dicey real quickly here ... First of all I would have to say there is consitency in top marks .. The bar is just lower .. Consistency this year is between 20.15 and 20.30 ... That and wins is what has Crawford ranked so highly on the IAAF chart .. However, outside of the World's B. Williams ran best .. He won Zurich Gateshead and a couple of others .. And placed second in races he didn't win .. He also had the #2 time 20.01 behind JJ's aberration .. So I am picking him for #2 .. On the women's side .. I am having trouble with 2 & 3 .. Here's my analysis .. I too am looking at Ferguson and White .. I see FErguson's advantage being that she edged white for the silver in Edmonton .. I see Whites advantage being The best sequence of marks for the season (better than Marion's when you get past 3 deep) .. Given this should reflect the whole season I am going with White here for #2 ..

That leaves easy #3's now .. Crawford for the men and Ferguson for the women ..

Number 4's .. For the men I agree with Malcolm .. Good set of marks .. Just hasn't learned hwo to put it together at teh right time yet .. Had the potential to make a run at nubmer 1 this year .. On the women's side I would say Jenkins ... Mostly becasue no ne else really stands out ..

Number 5's ... Well Christopher Williams seems easy on the men's side .. On the women's we can draw a name out of a hat .. I'll go with Cydonie Mothersill as she won a lot of races that didn't matter and she had a decent set of marks ...

The one person I feel should be on the list but am having trouble with shere is Ramon Clay .. Clay was clearly number one coming into the Championships ... Injury there kept him out of the second half of the European season .. Seems almost unfair to give Kederis or JJ a spot based on a single race when Clay at least had a very good 2/3 season .. Part of me says give him 3rd and move everyone else down a slot ... Doing so makes my suggestions the following

Men
1. Konstantinos Kederis
2. Bernard Williams
3. Ramon Clay
4. Shawn Crawford
5. Christian Malcolm

Women
1. Marion JOnes
2. Kelli White
3. Beverly McDonald
4. LaTasha Jenkins
5. Cydonie Mothersill

Comments, arguments suggestions ??? Still waiting to hear from our "casual fan" .. Smile

Dan · Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2001 11:13 am Post subject:

Well, I'm glad I'm not the only one that found the 200 a bit difficult to rank... I'm a bit surprised you don't view JJ as being deserving of a top 5 ranking, but I can certainly understand your reasoning. If he had done something similar in 2000, when there were a number of high quality marks (going waaayyyyy back to a whole year ago when we thought the 200 was the event to watch for the forseeable future!), then I would agree that one race means very little. However, when very few people run within two tenths of what he did, that seems signficant enough to take the place of some season-long consistency issues. On the other hand, the advantage of running in lane 9 may make it statistically invalid...

I also had a hard time with what to do with Ramon Clay. He does have the fourth fastest time and a lot of solid performances, so I suppose I'd have to side with you on moving him up. I don't think I'd place him higher than 5th, though.

Dan

Micah Ward · Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2001 1:05 pm Post subject:

My lack of an opinion on the 200 shows just how casual I am. My knowledge is too small to argue with the 200 rankings. Just one question on the 400's. How strange will it be to not have Michael Johnson mentioned?

Conway · Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2001 1:28 pm Post subject:

Ok .. How's this for the 200 ??

1. Konstantinos Kederis
2. Bernard Williams
3. Shawn Crawford
4. Ramon Clay
5. JJ Johnson

Clay over Johnson because he did have a good season going until the injury and he did run 20.05 to go with a much better set of marks and placings ..

Of course we will then be saying that the Worlds was a moot point as far as this event was concerned .. And I don't have a problem with that since there was so much inconsistency in this event outside of say the top 3 ... But just thought I would mention it ..

And Micah to me what will be strange more so than not having MJ will be not having a sub 44 since there has been one every year since about 1988 .. I will have to check to be accurate .. But I think that I am correct (or very very close) Smile

Dan · Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2001 2:36 pm Post subject:

Yeah, I can agree with that. Smile

Micah Ward · Posted: Sun Sep 23, 2001 4:06 pm Post subject:

This could be the lazy man's copout, but I would almost be willing to take the top 5 times of the year for the 400 and rank them in that order. Unless there was someone who won consistently...but no name springs to mind.

By the way Conway...a question Dan already answered in another post. You doing any racing? Personally I've fought a stress fracture all year but I do love the weekend road races. I would also love to hear about the racing of anybody that contributes to this forum. Don't mind if you even brag a little.

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