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Marion Jones ... Not in 2003 ...
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Conway
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 11, 2003 8:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Unfortunately Justin in America those in teh public eye are typically held to a different standard ... I agree with you ... I really don't care .... But corporations here do .. They also care quite a deal here about race .. And gender ... And while Marion has transcended those things in the past ... It will be more difficult this time around ... Although she has an unmatched charisma and may pull it off ... Only time will tell ... Tim was already in the position of being tough to market ... THis does not enhance that at all ... A black man in America with multiple children and multiple mothers and no marriage is NOT a marketers dream in this country .... For better or for worse - pun intended ...

Good to see you though Justin ... Was just looking at the whole of the sport with respect to this issue ... But back to the track ...

Tim opens in Mexico City ... Great venue, but could backfire ... If his time is not outstanding could create doubt as Mexico City is heralded for creating extremely fast clockings ...

Mo opening up in Los Angeles at the beginning of June ... And if he is smart will avoid running at Nationals unless he enters the 200 ...

Not sure where Gatlin is opening ... I think Capel is opening either this weekend or right after Penn ... I may know by tomorrow ...

What does it look like for the Brits ??? Haven't seen Dwain all season outside of your Nationals ... MLF and GArdener looked good indoors ... WAiting to see how they open ...

Frankie hasn't looked great which leads me to think that by Paris he will focus on the 200 .. Your thoughts ??
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Paul
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 11, 2003 9:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Actually, I care. And, although the days of the Westminster Chapel and the Charles Spurgeon and G. Campbell Morgan days are way behind us, there are many people in Great Britain that care. I side with Conway, again, at this stage. I'll bet Nike is burning the midnight oil figuring out damage control on this one. Even if the biological clock was ticking for Marion, it would have been prudent to shelve everything for 2 more seasons and reap what they could.

My prediction is that they will quickly become yesterday's news as other athletes move to the forefront. And I hope this will be the big year for GB's Dwain and MLF.

Paul
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Micah Ward
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2003 5:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

One more comment then I will shelve the "out of wedlock" issue. It is a shame that more people don't care about children born to single mothers. Ward's Worthless Opinion is that a lot of society's problems stem from a lack of strong father figures in the home.

Now back to track where I predict Gatlin and P-Block as the big winners this year.
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Justin
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2003 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The ideal for any kid is a stable, loving relationship with active participation from both parents. As someone who has been in a blissfull 9 yr unmarried relationship I bitterly resent the suggestion that any kid of ours would be disadvantaged compared to the children of a married couple. Mary and I are happier than any married couple we know and should we have children they would be brought up in a more stable and loving environment than the vast majority of marriages are able to offer.

40% of marriages in the UK end in divorce. The idea that marriage is a proxy for the sort of stability which (everyone agrees) kids need is simply offensive, primitive and wrong. What matters is that Tim and Marion love and cherish their child. To suggest that the existance or not of a marriage certificate would make any difference to this either way is idiotic.

Like I suggested, perhaps we should stick to sprinting.

Justin
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Dan
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2003 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My parents were never married, and I have the lack of citizenship to prove it...

I think Conway's main point was not that the parents are not married, but that Tim has a, er, track record of fleeing the parental scene. If that scenario plays out again, that could leave Marion with a large burden and quite possibly spell the end of her career. Neutral

Dan
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Conway
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2003 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan is correct in that that was my main point ... I have had a couple of long unmarried relationships in my life ... Each very good ... And had we had kids they would hve been brought up in a very loving home each time ...

However Tim's rep in thiis regard is not the best ... And even Marion's previous marriage ended rather abruptly ... I am not advocating for marriage so much as I am looking at the past experiences of the two individuals involved .. And it is for that reason I have concern for the child ...

As far as marketing goes I have no control over that ... That is in the hands of the professionals ... And it is to their way of thinking that i have addressed my posts ... Those who have the gold rule and it is their rules that one must play by if they want to share in the gold ....

Justin as liberal as the United States tries to come off to the rest of the world it is in reality a very provincial place ... At least in regards to the seats of power and money ... As are most seats of power within the world ...
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Dan
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2003 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.wnba.com/draft2003/draft_board.html

Check out pick #33. It's looking increasingly likely that we've seen the last of Marion Jones in Track & Field... Sad

Dan
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Dan
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 27, 2003 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No one wants to touch this one, huh? Neutral

Dan
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Conway
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2003 5:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Eh ... I touch em all ... NOt sure what to say ... Could say that it gives her an easy out ... Not sure if she put herself in teh draft or if someone just took a gamble ... I would find it hard to think that out of the blue someone would gamble like that ... Especially since she hasn't played in half a decade ... Or maybe even longer ... But ... I just think her career is over at this point ... But I could be wrong .. She could go into broadcasting or something else and would be welcomed ... Not sure why she would come back when she doesn't have to ... As far as getting records go, unless she moves up to the 400 I don't see that happening ... So best to be able to walk away for other reasons as opposed to leaving and saying I couldn't do what I thought I could ...
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Dan
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2003 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I would find it hard to think that out of the blue someone would gamble like that ...

My thoughts exactly. It's been nearly 10 years since her peak basketball exploits. Add on being pregnant now, and it's hard to imagine she's in the hoops conscience enough to warrant a selection unless she has privately expressed her intents.

Personally, I'd be happy to see her stay in the sport another 5 years and keep running "only" 10.7's and 10.8's. Historically, those are pretty good times even if they don't touch FloJo's surreal marks... I don't see that as a blemish on Marion's accomplishments, regardless of her having publicly stated she wanted the record.

Dan
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Paul
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2003 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I, too, read the article when you first posted it. I personally think someone was just tossing a pick away on that chance. The WNBA is on shaky ground, at best. With 2 teams folding, there is a lot of talent out there trying to land a job. And I don't think her basketball skills would be up to par compared with the pro players at this stage. Plus her earning power would be much greater if she were to continue running. Some teams are having a hard time even making the payroll. I will leave it up to the sprint experts to say if having the world's fastest person on your team would be a PR benefit.
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Conway
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2003 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan wrote:
Personally, I'd be happy to see her stay in the sport another 5 years and keep running "only" 10.7's and 10.8's. Historically, those are pretty good times even if they don't touch FloJo's surreal marks... I don't see that as a blemish on Marion's accomplishments, regardless of her having publicly stated she wanted the record.

Dan


Unfortunately the public will remember however ... Marion has hurt herself by making those kinds of statements ... HEr "Drive for 5" left her as a failure even though she won 5 medals at one Olympics ... No one talks about that because she had stated they were all going to be gold ... She set herself up for failure ... Same with the WRs ... No way she can get em ... But she made the statement ... So now if she doesn't get them her career will be considered a failure ... Unless of course she leave to raise her baby ... NO ONE will discount that !!!
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Dan
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2003 10:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Unfortunately the public will remember however ...

The public or the media? I never got the impression that the general sporting public felt she "failed" in Sydney. The media wouldn't let go of it, but it never seemed to catch on beyond that. Whenever I talk with general sports fans that know little about T&F and I mention Marion Jones, there's a brief pause, then the connection with world's best female sprinter. No failure connotation comes up...

Paul, the WNBA took a shot at JJK for very similar reasons -- past hoops skills, obvious athleticism, and major PR potential. There have to be a lot of basketball players out there at least as good as Marion and far less removed from their playing days who would have come to mind first for GMs looking to take a gamble. I just can't imagine the timing being purely coincidence with Marion's recent string of announcements.

Dan
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Conway
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2003 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Aren't the media and the public one and the same ??? The public only knows what the media tells them !!!

Either way I think Marion's "legacy" is near completion ... The next question is who is next ??? Before Marion Gwen .. Before Gwen Flo .. Before Flo Evelyn ... Next ??? Felix ??

Time for a new thread ??
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Dan
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2003 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Aren't the media and the public one and the same ??? The public only knows what the media tells them !!!

Generally yes, but I haven't gotten the impression that they are in this case. No one that doesn't follow the sport closely seems to remember Marion "failing" to win 5 golds. Ask a few people at work and see what their lasting perception of her is...

I don't see anyone yet who is the likely heir to Marion's throne. Definitely some young talent coming up, but no one has yet shown the personality to fill that role. I'm curious to see what Tayna Lawrence comes up with after last year's breakthrough season.

Dan
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