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100 m vs. 110 m world record progression:
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Indeurr
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 02, 2006 3:25 am    Post subject: 100 m vs. 110 m world record progression: Reply with quote

100 m vs. 110 m world record progression:

I can enjoy the cynicism of the professional athletes as much as the next guy.
Let start with Marion Jones and Justin Gatlin: she has been the queen of cynicism, and he was trying to create an image of the anti-doping knight in a shiny armor. This, however, makes Asafa Powell’s comments about how glad he is that Gatlin is ready to cooperate even more ludicrous.
Let analyze something:

10.4 1921 ~ 1920--H:13.4_ 1920--
9.95 1968 ~ 1970
9.93 1983 ~ 1980 --H:12.93 1981 ~ 1980--
9.86 1991 ~ 1990
9.79 1999 ~ 2000 –H: 12.88 2006 ~ 2005—

The men’s 100 m and 110 m world records have improved by (nota bene: both results form before World War Two were hand measured), if to use .25 adjustment, 0.22 seconds each in between 1920 or 1921 and 1983 or 1981. However, since the advent of the modern doping methods, during the 1980’s, the 100 m men’s world record has improved from 9.93 to 9.79 over the period of 16 years (from my perspective, it is only a matter of time when Powell will get busted; therefore, I do discount his world record), or by 0.14 second, and the 110 m H men’s world record has improved in between 1981 and 2006, or over the period of 25 years, from 12.93 to 12.88 seconds, or by 0.05 second.
The men’s world record over 100 m, however, has virtually remained the same since the year 1999 since the IAAF and the Olympic Committee has instituted a much stricter anti-doping policy.
Why does doping help the 100 m dashers much more than their hurdling counterparts? The answer seems to be simple: the 100 m hurdles are not just about speed – they are more cerebral (if you permit me to use this expression). A ground ponder athlete such as Ato Boldon would stand no chance in a hurdle competition: the ugly-style runner with a great leg turnover.
My suggestion would be that, if you can make a final on your own, taking a military or governmental lab quality LSD may help; however, steroids, as the above presented argument strongly supports, have proven rather ineffective in the world of high hurdles.


My best guess at the real clean (no doping) world record in men’s 100 m would be, and I am trying to be an extreme optimist here, 9.95 seconds from 1968 by Jim Hines.

Robert Kolakowski urodzony Grudzien 28, 1973 1515 (03:15 p.m.)
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Kishan Gill
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This assertion of yours has some merit and definitely needs looking into further.
I would think that drugs free the high hurdles time should have improved by a better margin because of the extra 10 metres and improvements in hurdling technique whereas their is very little you can do to improve in a flat race.
It is also worth comparing progression in the 400m hurdles and flat although lee evans altitude 43.86 does not really help in assessing progression from that period onwards.
What needs to be made clear is the distinction between times set by athletes from a broader base and exceptional performers like Johnson, Moses ,Powell etc or we could end up indicting all these athletes as cheats and dismissing the notion of naturally gifted super athletes.
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kishan Gill wrote:
This assertion of yours has some merit and definitely needs looking into further


Agreed - this a great topic that has the potential to throw-up some awesome discussion in the replies to it. All the regulars on this part of the Forums will love it. I'll post my opinions, etc. tomorrow
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Indeurr
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2006 7:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Two things:
-1) after athletes do break the world record or win a medal in the world or Olympic championships; they should have to donate 4—four samples: two for the anti-doping committee, one for the coach, and one for themselves. Ten years later the samples should be retested, and all doubts either put to a grave, or all medals and records stripped, with fines, but the athletes will be able to hold on to the price money unless sued by particular promoters and organizers. The medals should not be transferable, if taken away at the 10—year mark: the spaces in the officials entries should remain blank;
-2) if the progression was correct, than the current ‘clean’ world record would have to be about 9.90 seconds.

I may be wrong: there are people; it is a shame to say, in the world of science who claim scientific theories as facts. The very scientific method and the philosophy of science tell us that no scientific theory can be definitely proven, but only farther and farther supported with evidence. This part of the scientific method and philosophy of science is supposed to outweigh the resolve of the die—hard defenders of the Paradigm. For there to be progress, the paradigm, however, must change and keep on changing.
I am not a scientist, but I know that I may be wrong.
The need to impose one’s views on others (e.g.; "this theory" is substituted with "this fact") is human (all too human), and was pointed out by F. Nietzsche.
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Last edited by Indeurr on Sat Sep 09, 2006 4:00 am; edited 1 time in total
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Kishan Gill
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2006 4:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you can prove drug abuse or as ben johnson admitted to be taking drugs as far back as 1981 then all medals and times should be nullified.
Trying to recoup money is a messy affair but as you said that should be between the organisers and the athlete but a dishonest athlete should not be allowed to reap financial rewards.

Changing the subject slightly but staying on the theme of drugs I tend to use one rule of thumb to look out for potential abusers and that is a very heavy muscular build e.g the aforementioned but sprinting is a power event and there are different physical types , some that can increase muscle mass more than others such as lewis who was very lean but as conway pointed out does not necessarily mean he is clean ( Apart from the 88 trials episode I still rate him as one of the greatest ever).

As for hurdlers a leaner build does suit them better for increased mobility. Maybe another reason drugs (one's that help increase muscle mass) are not really any help.

Going back to the first chapter I still think it is a travesty that east german and czech records as well as flo-jos records still stand but their is no evidence on an individual case by case basis to support their annulment (Legal loopholes) despite the general accepted fact that their was a systematic state controlled drug program by many eastern bloc nations.
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Indeurr
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 4:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kishan Gill wrote:
If you can prove drug abuse or as ben johnson admitted to be taking drugs as far back as 1981 then all medals and times should be nullified.
Trying to recoup money is a messy affair but as you said that should be between the organisers and the athlete but a dishonest athlete should not be allowed to reap financial rewards.

Changing the subject slightly but staying on the theme of drugs I tend to use one rule of thumb to look out for potential abusers and that is a very heavy muscular build e.g the aforementioned but sprinting is a power event and there are different physical types , some that can increase muscle mass more than others such as lewis who was very lean but as conway pointed out does not necessarily mean he is clean ( Apart from the 88 trials episode I still rate him as one of the greatest ever).

As for hurdlers a leaner build does suit them better for increased mobility. Maybe another reason drugs (one's that help increase muscle mass) are not really any help.

Going back to the first chapter I still think it is a travesty that east german and czech records as well as flo-jos records still stand but their is no evidence on an individual case by case basis to support their annulment (Legal loopholes) despite the general accepted fact that their was a systematic state controlled drug program by many eastern bloc nations.

Many of the athletes have admitted that “they were given some pills and some shots by doctors.” The vagueness of their admissions may come from the fact that they, indeed, most especially in the East Germany and Soviet Union, did live in the near-totalitarian system during the 1970’s and 1980’s, but is, at least, as well caused by that they do not want to lose their medals, records, and prestige.
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Kishan Gill
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2006 8:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Without doubt these states are motivated on national lines than athletes individual desires which leads you to think what may be going on in china where their already have been admissions of problems of doping in certain provinces involving very young children mainly in the gymnastics disciplines.
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