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[AM_Runner]

long time no post here... hope I can get through all of these posts and catch up... worrk and the fairly new baby have been just dogging me but hopefully new year brings new time (yeah right)

Hope you all had a great Holiday season and are looking forward to a new year... which I am starting with an injury that I would like your input in to

Anyone have this happen to them? (Injury question) 1/5/2006 7:09PM Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

I have an odd injury here and I am curious if anyone has experienced the same.. Out on an easy run the other day and I am coming up a short hill when I feel a sharp pain in my calf. Of course (dumb I know) I run on it and it gets worse through the run but then feels better so I figure eh its a little tweak and it loosened up whil erunning and I am fine... well I drive home and I can't even walk - just limping around for the day... I take Ibuprophin and all it feels like a muscle pull underneath the outer calf muscle on the inside of my leg... IB and massage it although still sore the next day take that off and go out for an 8 mile loop the day after feels OK and feels a little sore after about 5 or 6 but not bad and no limping... The next day it feels fine as a matter of fact it feels great after increasing pace and distance over the next few days - a week and a half later I am just running along easy this time on a flat section and it happens again - I walk a bit and unfortunately I was 8 miles out so I had to struggle back at that point and do feel OK towards the end of the run. next day and the rest of the week with fartleks and all no issues at all - so new year comes around and I take a couple of days off then start running again - today I am out just going a long at a nice easy pace when bam it happens again and really hurts...

It feels like a muscle pull underneath the calf but it doesn't make sense to me how it just comes and goes like that... my pain can completely go away for days and I can run with no issue and then I go out on an easy run like yesterday and I am brought to a standstill by a sharp pain in what seems to be from what I am reading the underlying soleus muscle.

anyone experience anything like this? just curious - I figure to take a day or so off and see how it goes maybe get to the doc as well just to be safe...

Thanks...
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The long run is what puts the tiger in the cat.

[Dan]

That's the way calf cramps are... I had a similar thing about 4 years ago. Came on with no warning -- mid-stride while crossing a street -- came and went and lingered for much longer than I would have liked. Stretching, icing, and extended rest finally took care of it. I thought I had it beat several times after taking just a few days off, but it would return again. It wasn't until I took about a month off that it went away for good.

Dan
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[Micah Ward]

I had calf problems for about a year. An MRI revealed some slight tears in both calves. It took 9-10 months of rest, walking and very slow running before they finally got back to normal. The difference in mine and what you describe is that once mine started there were no really good days until after a few weeks of no running at all.
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[Fry the Sailor]

this sounds remarkably similiar to a the time pre-dating some major acchilles problems. I too had originally had been diagnosed w/ calf problems, even by my trainer. But, as time and the cross country season wore on, my pain got worse. Trust me, you may want to take the next few weeks VERY EASY. Though if you continue training, you might run the risk of some very severe pain. If you find yourself walking funny, get to a doctor and physical therapist soon. If you're like me, you might have collapsed arches and/or hypermobile joints in the feet. Interesting thing to note, due to my extreme mobility in my joints I torque both the inside and outside of the foot. Almost as if I both supinate and pronate. The solution given to me was some therapy to rebuild the archs and orthodic inserts.

Overall, I say check your feet and be critical. Are the arches too flat? Do the joints feel very flexible? If so get an over the counter orthodic and a visit to the physical therapist. If that doesn't help, step up to a visit to a sports therapist and get a custom orthodic if your insuarance covers it.

Even if your insuarance doesn't cover an orthodic, I highly reccomend one with or without injury. The level of comfort is absolutely superior
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[AM_Runner]

Thanks all for your input - althought it make me nervous es[ecially since its the 3rd time its happened. So I basically bailed on the rest of the week and am going to go see the Dr on Monday just to be safe - its only 14 weeks till Boston but I have a some real goo dtraining in recently so I want to nip this thing in the bud before it gets any worse so I am taking my time here even though its driving me nuts...

I will go out for an easy run probably Monday morning and see how it goes.

I am a very neutral striker and have normal to high arches. so I don't think that this is a machanics problem - not to say that my form is perfect or anything I know it needs work but I would say with a fiar amount of certainty that I don't feel that the issue lies in that area... but who knows

I will keep you all up to date....

On anotehr note... Dan how hard/easy would it be to get tix to teh Oregon Twilight Meet on 5/6 There is a good possibility that I will be out in Seattle for business that will keep me there over that weekend and if possible I am thinking about driving down.

Thanks again all.
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The long run is what puts the tiger in the cat.

[Dan]

There was nothing I could point to that brought on my calf problems, be it biomechanics or training load. Just happened. Literally, mid-stride... When I tried coming back gradually each time, I found short runs on soft surfaces kept the flare-ups to a minimum.

I don't think the Twilight meet sells out, so that shouldn't be any problem. I have no idea if I'll be going or not, but you definitely have a place to crash an hour from Eugene, if you want. I don't have a copy of our tentative schedule in front of me, but I believe we have a meet planned that day.

Dan
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[Indeurr]

[AM_Runner]

Well - lets see here I did go to the Doc Not the nbest of news or the worst either... just kind of eh...

He checked me out and feels that the issue is not in the Soleus but in the Gastroc muscles and/or the connective tissue bewteen them... sometimes tears form as we get older (which of course I am not )

Anyway he says to run and take Ibuprohin after runs - that if it was going to tear that it will and that if it does we would know how long it was going to take to get better - that we have a known quantity at that point - right now the pain comes and goes so get the runs in.

I did some additional research as well into types of massage since the muscle is so deep that ice never really gets to it so between the Ibuprophin and the self massage with hands and "the stick" (geez does that sound bad) I have cut back on the miles to a few 5 mile runs this past week which I will bump up to try for 35 muiles this week (all easy mind you) if that goes OK - I have had no pain yet... then it will be close to 3 weeks since the alst episode I will re-commence the Boston training next Monday - which will mark 12 weeks till race day. So its basically now or never

I go back to full training then although I will lay off the real speed and major hills probably another 2 weeks...

With Regards to the Oregon Twilight Meet - really Dan thats cool of you... Thanks I may just have to take you up on that one... I will let you know if it works out that I am out there then for sure!
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The long run is what puts the tiger in the cat.

[Dan]

Wow, that was a nearly useless visit. At least you found out which muscle group to target. Come to think of it, the advice he gave you is almost exactly what you'd expect to hear from someone, accompanied by an "I'm not a medical provider and you shouldn't follow this advice without consulting a doctor" disclaimer... Ibuprofin and run until it gets bad enough to be easier to diagnose? Give me a break. How does someone spew nonsense like that and call themselves a professional? By all means, pursue the deep tissue massage. Ask around and find the person with the best reputation in your area. That's the route that's virtually guaranteed to yield good results, medical field conventional wisdom be damned. Or, wait till you come out here and I'll hook you up for free...

Dan
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[AM_Runner]

Yeah I know the thing that really drives me nuts well one of a few things is that I keep thinking that I misunderstood something.

I know the guy is a good doctor and all I have been seeing him for years - he also runs and knows how I run. Has always given me good advice and treated all my injuries well perfectly keeping me out as little as possible. He was a team doctor for the Olympic Team at Albertville I believe so its not like he has no experience or anything

Plus I actually asked at the end of the exam if there was anything else to do like an MRI or some kind of test to get more data and he talked about those saying that you do thopse tests when you are unsure of the diagnosis - but I am not sure of it now.. so now I find myself questioning if I actually heard everything right.

Ahhh The thing now is that I am sooo tentative on things which hopefully will stop soon I need that edge... but it will come just need to be patient
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The long run is what puts the tiger in the cat.

[Dan]

Strange, he doesn't sound like the type that would've given that copout diagnosis.

Dan
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[AM_Runner]

I know thats what bugs me the most about it...

A friend of mine is going to go see him on Thursday so I am going to see if she can get some more info out of him as well.

On the bright side got in another 5 miles this morning at around 8 - 8:30 min pace with no issues.
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The long run is what puts the tiger in the cat.

[AM_Runner]

OK well figured I would throw in an update now that it seems to be 4 weeks and no pain... I did find someone with a great reputation right in the area - she was with the US Olympic Team as a Massage Therapist in the 2004 Athens Games and a group of runners i know highly recommended her... SO I went and feel very good she said a few things around that I just had soo many knots in my calf muscles and that the outer gastrocs were much stronger than the inner ones. She said that it may be due to the lower portion of my legs being slightly bowed out causing the outside to develop more than the inside - and that this could cause some pulling on the inner gastroc which in turn coul dhave been the pain I was experiencing

It was the left that was giving me a problem which led me to think about things and curious what you guys thought about this... We as distance runners do a lot of miles by necessity when we are able to... much of many of our miles unfortunately get done on the roads... (I try to get on the trails but a lot of the times here in the winter thats not possible) when running to see oncoming traffic we run opposite to the flow of trffic.. the camber of the roads are tilted so that the left leg would take a bit more pounding - Then we also do spedwork on a track where we run in left hand turns further stressing the inside leg... I always try to do cooldowns and the like opposite on the track or on grass... but I was wondering if any thought this idea may have some merit.

Anyway its back to full training I will try to lay out my plan and find a way to post it here for Boston (only 11 weeks away now whew) by the end of the weekend!
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The long run is what puts the tiger in the cat.

[Dan]

Excellent!

I've long noticed the heavily cambered roads to be problematic to the lower legs, especially when there's a condition already present to aggravate. The best I've come up with is simply to run on the other side as much as possible (i.e. out and backs), if the route can't be changed sufficiently.

Dan
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[AM_Runner]

Yeah I try to do the same or stay off of them as much as I can...

Anyway I may have spoken too soon after two runs of 8 miles a piece Sunday and Tuesday the second of which in a cold rain with no issues - I go on an easy 3 mile run last night and my calf seizes up - felt mor elike a cramp than the pain I had before but jeez this is a pain in the ass
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The long run is what puts the tiger in the cat.