Run-Down Forums

[Dan]

[Conway]

Justin thanks for that progression on Curtis Johnson ... I knew he had dropped from high school but didn't realize it was that dramatic !!!!! Would be very interesting to compare the progressions of some of the world's best and see how they compare ... Greene, Montgomery, Chambers, and Thompson for example to see how they have done vis a vis their seeming potential at a young age ... I threw in Oba cause of that 9.69 - that and he just seems to be dripping with potential ... And kudos to Justin on Curtis Johnson ... I was wracking my brain last night going through youngsters and just assumed he graduated at 18 ... ... so much for assumptions ...

Conway

[Conway]

Back to next season ... Following is copy from Washington Post on the HSI squad:

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Run-Down Elite HSI Team Tries to Get Back on Track Maurice Greene and Inger Miller waved the HSI flag at 1999 U.S. championships, but "everybody has been touched by some kind of adversity," said Miller, the fifth-place finisher in the 100 this year. (Tony Duffy - Sporting Image) _____HSI's Struggles_____ Maurice Green 2001 world champion, 2000 Olympic gold medalist in 100. 2002: Lost 100-meter world record; ended season with two fifth- and two sixth-place finishes. Ato Boldon Won 2000 Olympic silver medal in 100, bronze in the 200. 2002: Left European circuit this summer after eighth-, sixth- and seventh-place finishes in 100. Inger Miller Won gold in 200, silver in 100 at 1999 world championships. 2002: Didn't win a race this season; finished fifth in the 100 at the U.S. championships. Lawrence Johnson 2000 Olympic pole vault silver medalist, 2001 world indoor champion. 2002: Finished eighth at the U.S. championships. By a Washington Post Staff Writer Thursday, October 3, 2002; Page D01 Three years ago, a trash-talking, muscle-flexing, self-promoting group of Los Angeles-based sprinters called HSI blasted to the center of the track and field universe, loudly assuming its place as the modern version of the once ballyhooed Santa Monica Track Club. HSI's members spouted charisma, flashed attitude and, most importantly, amassed phenomenal success. The group included Maurice Greene, formerly the world's fastest man; top sprinters Ato Boldon and Jon Drummond; Inger Miller, a former world champion; and a sprinkling of other Olympic medal winners and contenders. This summer, however, HSI displayed blinding speed only in its plummet into the neighborhood of the merely above-average. Members once boasted that the letters in the HSI masthead stood for Handling Speed Intelligently (it's really Hudson-Smith International); they might seek a more appropriate nickname after a Humbling Season Internationally. HSI watched the unwelcome relocation of the temple of track and field from its backyard to a laid-back training group in a laid-back town -- Raleigh, N.C. -- the home of Marion Jones, her boyfriend Tim Montgomery and their soft-spoken coach, Trevor Graham. HSI officially includes 23 athletes (10 are members of the Saudi Arabian national team) and it attracts the occasional high-profile visitor (Christine Arron and Cathy Freeman have had stints with HSI) but is best known by the tight-knit core of about a half-dozen that regularly trains in Los Angeles: Greene, Boldon, Drummond, Miller, Larry Wade and a few others. Within the last few months, that dynamic band of athletes has been reduced to underdog status and driven to the previously unthinkable: self-doubt and second-guessing. "Everybody has gone through their down time," said Miller, who finished fifth in the 100 meters at the U.S. championships in June. "Everybody has been touched by some kind of adversity in the last two years. I think the storm is coming to an end. . . . We're motivated by what's happened to get HSI back to where we were." HSI's freefall concluded with a very public crash landing: In Paris a few weeks ago, the unofficial captain, Greene, sat helplessly in the stands as Montgomery stole from him the title of world's fastest human, breaking Greene's three-year-old world record in the 100 meters just minutes after Jones had become the women's Grand Prix champion. Earlier in the summer, Greene -- who is known as "Mo" and has T-shirts that read "Pheno-Mo-nal" -- earned an unfortunate new nickname: "Slow Mo," courtesy of a mischievous member of the European media. Greene, whose season lowlights included two sixth-place and two fifth-place finishes as well as the slowest time (a 10.56 in the 100) of his professional career, was joined in his disappointment by Miller, who has all but disappeared from individual medal stands since winning the 200-meter world title in 1999; and Boldon, who quit in the middle of the summer to go home to Trinidad and Tobago because, he said, he hadn't run so slowly since high school. Pole vaulter Lawrence Johnson, the 2000 Olympic silver medalist who trains only occasionally with the other HSI members in Los Angeles, also had a dismal outdoor season, starting with his perplexing eighth place at the U.S. championships in June. Other members struggled less resoundingly -- Drummond started slowly but finished strong; hurdler Wade won a handful of races and finished the season ranked fourth in the world, but his top mark (13.15 seconds) did not approach his career-best of 13.01. Group members say the lack of incentive inherent in a season with no Olympic Games or world championships provided only a sliver of the problem; they say they were blindsided by much more debilitating difficulties. Greene, alone, faced enough distractions to sidetrack the entire group. Sources close to HSI say he was involved in a motorcycle accident last fall; he and his teammates decline to confirm or deny the persistent rumor. In December, his paternal grandmother died; then, he lost two more close relatives in the next couple of months. Meanwhile, the renegotiation of his contract with Nike began -- disastrously. Greene, who had won an Olympic gold medal and achieved a world record in Nike shoes, said he requested his own commercial and a signature shoe. He said Nike declined. Greene was furious over the snub. By then, h he said, he was becoming an emotional wreck. Emanuel Hudson, the group's manager, urged Greene to begin seeing a therapist. Greene did. Talking about his problems, he said, helped. He eventually signed with Adidas. He didn't, however, begin training seriously until April. The seemingly indestructible, indefatigable Greene learned then that he did have limits, that he could collapse. Greene sensed he was hurtling toward a mid-season breakdown, given the lack of proper conditioning, strength training and overall preparation. Though he won the 100 meters at the U.S. championships in a wind-aided 9.88 seconds, Greene still felt insecure. Miller said she was stunned Greene had pulled off such a time with so little training behind him. His season, not surprisingly, sank like a cement block in shallow waters after that. "All I've been saying is, I can't wait for this year to be over with," Greene said. Miller's calamities have been largely physical. She has injured and re-injured her left hamstring so many times she wishes she could have a transplant. She and Boldon both were found guilty of minor drug-testing infractions in the last couple of years; she, for testing positive for too much caffeine and he, for the stimulant ephedrine, which he said came from using a cold medication when he was sick. Other legal problems have plagued the group. HSI Coach John Smith, who declined to comment for this story, is still embroiled in legal battle stemming from an altercation in a bar last year with former HSI member Anjanette Kirkland and her mother. Drummond this spring pleaded not guilty to charges that he transported marijuana in a backpack at Los Angeles International Airport last year. "We've made all the money, bought all of the cars, all of the houses and we've been on every show," Boldon said. "But now we've had tough times. I don't think we're going to be judged by when we were on top. We're going to be judged by what we do now." The struggles of the group's most respected leaders spread like an infection. On top of that, little problems further inflamed a sensitive situation. HSI had lost many of its privileges with UCLA after Smith resigned his coaching position in December after 17 years with the university. Suddenly, HSI members had to fight for time in the weight room. They no longer could come and go as they pleased. The schedule disruptions grew so exasperating Hudson negotiated a deal for the group with 24 Hour Fitness, a health club chain. Greene, meanwhile, had a full-size gym built in his new home. Even before the problems peaked, Boldon decided he needed to get away from the sport. After a half-dozen years as arguably the most consistent elite sprinter in the world, Boldon told Hudson last year he wanted to take a sabbatical. His lower back was sore; he couldn't lift weights vigorously. Boldon said he never considered retiring, wasn't unhappy with HSI or Smith. He simply wanted to enjoy the new home in Trinidad and Tobago the government had purchased for him. Hudson's response? No way. Reminding Boldon that he was in the last year of his contract, Hudson urged Boldon to compete. Boldon finally agreed. However, his results proved what he already knew: he wasn't enthusiastic or physically strong. He left the European circuit midway through the season to go home. But once he arrived in Trinidad and Tobago, he said, he was involved in a head-on collision with a taxi cab that totaled his car and left him with minor injuries. Rumors abounded that Boldon had retired. But he is back in Los Angeles and, he says, ready to begin training for next season. On Saturday, Boldon, Greene, Drummond, Wade and Miller got together for a cookout at Greene's new home. They had a contest to see who could barbecue the best. In two weeks, they will get back to the track with Smith, back to work. "Everyone thinks we're dead," Greene said. "We're going to surprise a lot of people next year. When you break a bone, it grows back even stronger than before. That's going to be us. "It seemed like everything happened to us at one time. Now, we're all over it, ready to get back doing what we normally do. It's going to be fun for us. It's not going to be fun for other people." © 2002 The Washington Post Company

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I would say 9.89 from only training from April forward is AWESOME ... Let alone the other issues ...

Conway

[Dan]

Do you have a link to the article? It's a bit tough to read in that format...

Dan

[Conway]

They charge for the info after the first day ... So linking won't work and I didn't have the good sense to osave it yesterday ...

Conway

[Dan]

If all of that is true, it seems pretty dumb of Greene to have committed to run the entire Golden League circuit! It sounds like he knew the season would get progressively worse, so why not leave more options open for a cameo appearance? Over confident, perhaps?

Dan

[Conway]

If I remeber correctly, Mo signed the deal after Nationals ... Having run 9.88w AND beating Montgomery I'm sure that his confidence level was sky high .... And to have done it by only starting in April to boot !!!

And to his credit he beat Tim fairly ocnsistently over the season ... And seeing as he veiwed Tim as his chief rival, he WAS on target ... The problem was that Dwain became the X factor for him this year .... If Dwain had NOT had the improvements he did this year, we would probably be having a totally different conversation about Mo ... He would have continued his domination of Tim (as he basically did) .. Tim probably would NOT have broken the WR as Dwain was a major catalyst for that ... Mo ends the season with a 9.89 season best, and victories over Tim ... Makes him a repeat #1 and all is fine ...

Instead Dwain improves and upsets the apple cart .. HE becomes Mo's foil ... Tim is able to let Mo go mentally and begin to focus on Dwain ... Tim gets race of lifetime against Dwain ... Mo ends season with multiple defeats and loss of record !!!!! Dwain changed the game this year !!!!

Conway

[Dan]

[Conway]

I think that while he may have felt insecure with his 9.88w at Nationals that:

a) that was becasue of his own standrads for himself timewise and
b) the fact that Tim was sooo close

I still think her realized that he had Tim's number as he continued to beat him ..

As for Dwain, note that with each successive loss to Dwain Mo got progressively slower ... That was where the psychie really came in to play ... Mentally strong Mo would not have let things like jet lag get him down ... Mentally weak he became human and all sorts of "little" t hings became distractions/problems .... Dwain was the main catalyst behind the poor season of Mo as he did what NO ONE else has been able to do for over half a decade - create reality based doubt ...

Conway

[Conway]

Update time ... Looks like Tim plans to have his own distractions this off season ... Note info from another source:

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....the truth is that the Graham camp is a mess. We knew that. Charlie Francis is all up in there with Tim (we had heard that) and they are actually feuding over money. Apparently Tim has a history of not paying those who work for him. Leaving is a possibility, but doesn't seem likely. Worse, Marion has sided with Tim and would leave if he does....WOW! Now is it just me or is this girl's intelligence over-rated....that is the consensus these days....I always thought she was so smart but some of these decisions lately....FATHERS with daughters take note...don't take off or they will have issues later on...she has issues with men, no doubt....Tim is actually a step in the right direction if I'm honest, though.
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..Tim told Nike that he and Marion would not even consider going back to Trevor, if Trevor had CJ weight train Justin for the upcoming season. Tim is very afraid of what CJ could do for Justin. Trevor and Justin agreed to abide by Nike's request (based upon the ultimatum given to Nike by Tim) to not have CJ train Justin, so at the moment Trevor is weight training Justin himself. The word, by those who have directly observed their weight training sessions on a daily basis, is that Trevor is completely "clueless" in the weight room.
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Sparks of problems if you ask me ... I'm not one for gossip, so don't really intend to discuss t his .. Although the source is a very good one ... But I do look at it as a part of the off seasono that MUST go right for Tim if he has any hope of maintaining his top position ... And the hone thing that I have noticed time and time again is that when athletes start making sweeping changes for the wrong reasons they usually head backwards ...

And he should know that whatever prblems Mo had last year HE is workign on fixing ... Advantage Mo ... And I would bet that Dwain is equally working to maintain his gains from last year ... Advantage Dwain ...

Success has apparently gone to Timmy's head ... Advantage everyone ...
_________________
Conway
Speed Thrills

[Dan]

Hmm, that looks to be one very slippery slope developing out in N.C. ...

Dan

[Conway]

Well ... BASed on what has been said about Mo's offseason last lyear and the results ... This doesn't bode too well for Tim and his upcoming season ... And Tim is not as strong mentally as Mo ... I mean someone who needs to wear his girl frineds shoes or use her blocks in order to generate good performances is not the kind of guy that can stand too much controversy during what is arguably the most important part of the season - the training season ..
_________________
Conway
Speed Thrills

[Dan]

[Conway]

[Dan]

As much as Michael Johnson was talked down for his various personal traits, revisionist history, questionable injuries, etc., he was also one of the best examples I know of of sticking to what worked best for him and avoiding the pitfalls of stardom. I leant his book to a friend, but when I get it back, maybe I should send it over to Timmy...

Dan