Run-Down Forums

[Guest]

My daughter is preparing for her sophomore CC season. She ran X last Fall and Track this Spring. Her PR is CC was 20:15 for 5K on a fairly tough course. In track she ran the 800 and 1500 with PRs of 2:27 and 5:25.

Last year she prepared for the X season by getting up to 40 miles for a couple of weeks -- averaged around 32 miles/week for the summer. (mileage includes warmups and cooldowns). For track this Spring she got up to 35 miles/week and then was down to around 25 for the latter part of the season. But she now does her workouts much faster (over a minute/mile faster).

She is planning to get up to 50 miles/week -- beginning at 35 and staying at 50 for a few weeks before the racing season begins in late August. She will maintain the faster work outs this Summer.

Does this seem like a reasonable plan and one that does not look like it will lead to injury? She has run injury free to this point.

She has been running since 7th grade -- and did 3 to four days of running (15-20 miles/week) until last summer.

Thanks for your help.

[Dan]

It sounds like an excellent plan, and one which not surprisingly has led to very solid times for her early in her running career. Nothing jumps out to nitpick, so all I can say is good job!

Dan

[Guest]

Thanks for your help. The PR of 5:25 was for the 1,600, not 1,500.

This is the workout I have her doing right now. SHe trains with a heart rate monitor.

Training Week 1: Week of 6/03/01
Warm up and cool down should be part of each run unless stated otherwise. Do the stretching exercises after each run. Do the strengthening exercises when you do not do the explosive exercises. Miles
Monday 4 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm). 6 X 100 at the end of the run to improve leg speed. 4
Tuesday 5 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 5
Wednesday Warm up and cool down of two miles each. 8 X 40 seconds fast (1:15 for 400M pace) with a jog for 2:20 (roughly a lap) 6
Thursday 5 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 5
Friday Easy run -- 3 miles (165 to 180 bpm) 3
Saturday Long run -- 7 miles (150 to 165 bpm) 7
Sunday 5 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 5
Total Mileage 35

Training Week 2: Week of 6/10/01
Miles
Monday 6 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 6
Tuesday 4 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 4
Wednesday Warm up and cool down of two miles each. 8 X 40 seconds fast (1:15 for 400M pace) with a jog for 2:20 (roughly a lap) or 3K Race 5
Thursday 5 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 5
Friday Warm up and cool down of one mile each. 3 X 1600 at 6:40 pace (180-195 bpm) with a one lap jog (2:00) between repeats. 5.5
Saturday Long run -- 8 miles (150 to 165 bpm) 8
Sunday 4.5 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 4.5
Total Mileage 38

Training Week 3: Week of 6/17/01
Miles
Monday 5 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm). 6 X 100 at the end of the run to improve leg speed. 5
Tuesday 7 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 7
Wednesday Warm up and cool down of two miles each. 8 X 40 seconds fast (1:15 for 400M pace) with a jog for 2:20 (roughly a lap) or a short Race 5
Thursday 5 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 5
Friday 5 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 5
Saturday Long run -- 10 miles (150 to 165 bpm) 10
Sunday 6 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 6
Total Mileage 43

Training Week 4: Week of 6/24/01
Miles
Monday 4 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 4
Tuesday Warm up and cool down of one mile each. 10 X 40 seconds sprint with a jog for 2:20 (a lap). 5
Wednesday 4 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm). 4
Thursday Warm up and cool down of one mile each. 3 X 1600 at 6:40 pace (180-195 bpm) with a one lap jog (1:30) between repeats. 5.5
Friday Off Day
Saturday Long run -- 10 miles (150 to 165 bpm). Will have to do it early in the morning -- before we leave for Miami 10
Sunday 5.5 miles easy (165 to 180 bpm) 5.5
Total Mileage 34

She will then begin increasing mileage again -- up to 50/week and hold there -- 3 weeks high and 1 week low -- through the end of August.

[Dan]

For a 1600, that is definitely a good time. That looks to be a well structured plan. My only real concern is a lack of rest days. I only see one day off in week 4. If she's remained injury free, then it may be that she can handle the constant workload. I'm of the mind that a day off every week or two is generally a good thing, although it obviously makes it more difficult to accumulate mileage.

Dan

[Guest]

I took your advice and changed the schedule to have a day off on high mileage weeks and two days off in the drop down week.

[Dan]

I look forward to hearing how it goes!

Dan

[Guest]

50 miles a week is a bit much for a pre-sophmore girl. What's the big hurry? That Multi-time 5000 meter olympian from westerville ohio (his name escapes me at the moment. bob something. anyway, up 'til very recently he's been america's best at 5k) only ran 35 miles a week throughout highschool. This is a time to concentrate on your speed, and tactics. Going too far too soon is likely to lead to burnout.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'donk']

[Dan]

I believe Kennedy is the name you're looking for. When he says he ran 35 a week, are you sure he wasn't just counting hard miles?

As I have said before (it bears repeating, since it is often over looked and seen as anti-mileage), I have no problem with high mileage, as long as quality is not sacrificed in order to get there. The above workout plan seems to do fine in that regard, and the althlete has shown the ability to handle and excel with that training load.

Dan

[Guest]

yes. kennedy. He was very talented of course, and his coaches "knew what they had". So, they didn't want to use him up in, in the true scope of things, relatively meaningless high school meets when he had such promise. And he was still state champ. Don't all kids deserve such treatment? I hate to see kids make too much progress too soon and then get discouraged when the improvement stops. They are faced with the drudgery of all that mileage to try to keep improving--and can lose interest. Obviously this girl is very talented. Just maintaining her current 35-40 mile a week training will allow her to improve her mile time 15 seconds next year as she naturally becomes more mature. What more do you want?

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Donk']

[Dan]

The danger, as I see it, is trying to fit everyone into the same mould of development. What works for one individual might be over training for someone else and might hold back another. I agree that too much too soon is worse than too little early on, but who's to say where this girl is on her development curve? When Mary Slaney was an internationally competitive runner at the age of 13 or 14, or more recently Georgie Clarke, should training be curtailed for fear of developing too soon?

It's an especially difficult situation with high school girls, as they often mature their first or second year of hs, while boys might hit that same point at the end of hs or early in college. The logical conclusion is that an earlier maturing athlete can up their training load earlier, although I don't recall ever seeing that approach taken.

Dan

p.s. It is true that she may be able to improve 15 seconds next year by maintaining mileage, but it's equally true that she may not improve at all or even get slower by doing that.

[Guest]

Let's face it, the workout's done in highschool do not vary much at all, year after year. I mean, seniors, juniors and sophomores all do the same workouts-- the differences are not done by what year they are in, but on ability. The distances (mileage weekly) are the same for all, but those that can handle it do it faster. Of course the individual can do more in the morning or on weekends, but most don't. And the vast majority who do what the coach asks of them improve by doing these same workouts over the 3 years because they get older and stronger. The ones that don't improve are the ones that "cheat", take days off, or hold back the quality of their workouts, and hence natural progression, to run with their lesser talented friends on the team. This girl seems serious enough, if willing to do what I still say is asking too much of a freshman/sophomore, that she won't have that problem. It is therefore far from equally likely that she'd run the same times or get worse from maintaining her current workouts. What you don't take into account is that extra mileage is no guarentee of improvement--she could get overtired, develop nutritional deficiencies, and/or get injured.

[Anonymously Posted by: 'Donk']

[Dan]

Trust me, I'm the last person to assume added mileage guarantees improvement. I also don't believe for a minute that natural progression is the answer to improvement. It's the safe way, but so what? Humans haven't gotten any fitter in the past 100 years. On the contrary, the western population has gotten much less fit of late. So, how do generations keep improving? Some of it is due to better shoes and surfaces, but I'm of the belief that that is fairly minimal for most people. People improve by doing things better and/or in more volume than the people before them. I'd almost go so far as to say that's mutually exclusive from natural progression.

You're right that many high school programs probably do not differentiate workouts between the 3 or 4 grades, but that's a flaw, if you ask me. In college, most athletes have matured physically, so they are all more or less on an even playing field. They can handle similar workloads. The 14-18 year olds in high school are at very different levels physically, and that should be reflected in their training. York HS -- many would argue is the best program in the country -- does this in a very structured fashion.

Dan

[Guest]

hey
Iam recovering from a pulled hamstring injury, which I got in mid march 2001, these past 2 weeks I have felt really good, and I ran a 5k. My time was 19:42, how can I get my speed back? Iam soo slow now??? I have no kick anymore, and my legs are always tight. Whats the best thing to do?

[Dan]

What are you training for? XC in the fall? The best thing to do for a hamstring injury is to find a highly related (from a sports standpoint) teep tissue massage therapist and have them work out the scar tissue. Otherwise, you risk re-injury any time you try to up the tempo. Once your hamstring is healthy, you can add back in any speed/pace work that has helped you in the past.

Dan