Run-Down Forums

[g.o.]

'According to Olympic historian Cordner Nelson, Juantorena's double was "the greatest exhibition of speed and durability in history." '

That's from www.coolrunning.com, which lists Alberto at #13 all time. I put him up for consideration on this topic, not for "global" reasons, but as a resident of the Americas. You can argue Johnson, Lewis, and Owens as runners, but they were sprint distance only. Edwin Moses has to be considered because of the amazingly long streak and overwhelming number of top times, but the intermediates are a specialty that doesn't attract as many competitors. Juantorena's decision to run the 800 was last minute and not seriously considered and he set a world record. His 400 was the fastest time ever run at sea-level and third all-time behind the gold and silver performances at Mexico City's altitude enhanced Olympics. This guy straddled the cusp of sprint and middle distance. No one before or since has come close to possessing anything near this accomplishment.

[Dan]

If Cuba can be considered part of America from an athletics standpoint, I say we naturalize the whole Carribbean and go 1 through 8 in every major sprint championship!

Dan

[g.o.]

Well the parameter set was "America" not USA, and with that in mind (parameters set by the initial post, that is) we have to nominate FloJo....
_________________
g.o.

[Dan]

Tough to ignore FloJo, but similarly tough to acknowledge her for reasons of major suspicion...

Dan

[Conway]

[Dan]

Let's not forget Geb's 1500m best was indoors and beat the previous world record, albeit in a second place effort.

Dan

[g.o.]

I love this discussion board. Glad to see some people talking about running in a smart, open forum like this.

With regards to my championing of El Caballo, don't dismiss "the same competition" as a comeback when it's a legitimate testament to the man's accomplishment. My main idea was to throw Alberto into the mix of great American runners and the primary reason is for having straddled that sprint/middle distance fence in an unparalleled fashion. MJ's accomplishments are fantastic, but they are all contained within a single lap around the oval. I'm a huge Edwin Moses fan, having competed in the intermediates myself, and I still use many of the training concepts I picked up from his routines. The way he created a science out of his event has, in my opinion, also humble, had great impact on T&F since the late seventies, early eighties. It's too bad he was denied the 1980 Olympics as I'm certain he'd have added to his amazing accomplishment.
_________________
g.o.

[Dan]

Off topic: Do you mind sharing your name? I'm trying to think if I know any G.O.'s in Portland, but none are coming to mind...

Dan

[g.o.]

Don't mind sharing at all, my friend's and family call me Greg. I don't know any Dans in Salem, err, didn't until now.
_________________
g.o.

[Conway]

On topic I'd have to agree with the assessment of Moses .. I would say that more than anyone he brought a more "technical" aspect to the sport .. His exactness was something that seemed (to me) to be emulated by Tellez and his work with the SMTC group and is continued with Smith and HSI .. These people all look(ed) at the little nuances of sprinting/hurdling which all too often make the difference in place at the end of a race ... This combined with his performances would have ot put him high on any list of greatest evers ...

[Distance_Guru]

I would put Moses as one of the greatest athletes in our sport ever. I think, there are very few in any event in track and field that can lay claim to the same level of greatness that he had in his prime. Bubka (sp?) in the pole vault, Lewis in the LJ and 100 at his prime, JJK in the multi's and maybe MJ at his very best in the 400 and 200. Although with the exception of Bubka in the pole vault I don't think anyone was as great for as long as Moses.
_________________
Time is the fire in which we burn

[Micah Ward]

Moses deserves to be mentioned in any discussion of the all time greats. No one has dominated their event the way he did. Except maybe a certain female looooooooong distance runner in California...

[Dan]

Way to sneak that Trason reference in and one-up Conway's attempt to keep us on topic.

Dan

[Conway]

You know I knew it had beena while since we had heard about Ann .. .. But she is deserving ..

As far as greatness equal to Moses .. I would say Bubka in the pole vault definitely .. Lewis in the long jump (but not the 100) .. MJ in the 400 (but not the 200) .. And believe it or not perhaps Dailey Thompson in the decathlon - he competed for a long time at a high level and won several majors ..

But back on Ameraican soil (North AND South I presume) I stick wiht Moses based on range of events and quality .. Although I will forever have this thought that he raced more towards the end to protect the streak ..

[Micah Ward]

If Moses raced to protect the streak toward the end, is that necessarily a bad thing? I think it would just be human nature to try to preserve that type of streak. I am not familar with how he raced toward the end of his career. What did he do? Less races? Races with weaker competion?

BTW, wonder woman won the Quicksilver 50 miler this past weekend in 6:45 (6 hours and 45 minutes). Over 45 minutes ahead of the first male runner. Trail race on a very hilly course, 5400 total feet of elevation gain.

Got to go. Time to put the shrimp on to boil.