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Training Talk
~The Mile/1500m Run~
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Angelo Z
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have reduced my mileage to 75. I have decided that from now on I will always hit 75 miles as my max. I feel as if 100 miles+ is changing my body entirely, making me more of a marathoner.
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My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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Angelo Z
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Joined: 11 Aug 2007
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Location: LA, California

PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Next week I will start my official aerobic power season by myself. It will generally look like this:

Sunday: 60 minutes @ 5:30 pace or "hard long run"
Monday: AM 30 minutes @ 5:00 pace PM 5 miles easy
Tuesday:AM 4x2000m @ 4:25 pace PM very easy 5 miles @ 9:00 pace
Wednesday:rest
Thursday:3x3000m @ 4:30 pace then 6x10 sec. hill sprints
Friday: AM 6x1000m @ 4:15 pace PM 30 minutes @ 5:00 pace
Saturday: 60 minutes with 6 x 1 mile surges @ 4:35 pace

The idea here is to get in pure aerobic power. The hill sprints are there to just help me maintain my running power, and the workout on Saturday is for helping me learn to recover while running kind of like a fartlek.
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My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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ssteve235
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

God i know this is a moot point by now. but back up your "training sessions" with an actual verifiable race. Your "repeats" of 3000s would have won you the new york state title in the two mile and the winner of the nike outdoor nationals for the two mile pace is only 5 seconds faster then your training pace. You are saying that in training, you can beat the current fastest high school two miler in the entire USA?
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Angelo Z
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Joined: 11 Aug 2007
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Location: LA, California

PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 7:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Maybe, I won't know until I race. I take running very seriously, for me it's not about running through high school, then college and to win a couple races for fun. I want to have a career with this sport. I also want to wait more until I get faster. That way when I do join a race, no one will ever know what I'm capable of because I won't have a history of racing like Webb, Ryun, Fernandez, and a lot of other runners had. I do all of my training alone, and all my time trials on any track I can find.
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My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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Dan
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Joined: 22 Mar 1999
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PostPosted: Sat Aug 22, 2009 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What happened to the promise that you were going to come back with race results to verify the times before posting any more of your training? Confused

Dan
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Angelo Z
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 23, 2009 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I said I will, but not when specifically. I don't even have my top speed at the moment.
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My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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Angelo Z
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Joined: 11 Aug 2007
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Location: LA, California

PostPosted: Mon Aug 24, 2009 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

On Sunday, I actually ran for 60 minutes at 5:20 pace instead. I was kinda surprised because those paces were just estimates. Then today on Monday, I ran for 30 minutes at 5:00 pace. It didn't even feel that strenuous, I mean the pace was strenuous but the time wasn't. It went by really fast since most of my base work runs took a much longer time.
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My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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Angelo Z
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Joined: 11 Aug 2007
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Location: LA, California

PostPosted: Fri Aug 28, 2009 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A new type of workout just went through my head. Why must there always be surges but not double surges? For example, you run for 60 minutes with 4x1000m surges, but then you can surge again during each 1000m surge and run the last 400 at 800m race pace. I also believe that surges help cut on training time. Instead of doing a session of 6x1000m intervals to become faster at tempo runs or instead of doing 400s to become faster at 1000s, if everything is just put together instead of doing a lot of separate sessions, then it should help the body adapt more efficiently to certain paces. After a hard session like that, I've thought that the next day could be a shorter run with shorter, more scarce, surges. This is because it would be too hard on the body to just do hard workouts everyday.

The main reason that I consider surges to be the most efficient is because of the feel on the legs. Here is what I mean: if you run 4x2000m @ 4:30 mile pace and then run 5 miles @ 5:50 pace afterwards, the leg muscles will be adjusted to the 4:30 mile pace stress which will cause the 5:50 pace to feel much much easier than it would normally. This constant exposure of the muscles being transitioned to a slower pace after a fast pace will cause the slower pace to increase overall over time. It's a totally different feeling when you run at an easy pace after running a bunch of 400s as opposed to running at an easy pace only for that day. However, that's just the concept, those easy miles after a bunch of intervals will mostly serve as a cool-down, so I instead thought of making both intervals and continuous running one workout. By doing the intervals during the overall continuous run, stimulates the aerobic system more along with making it feel easier to run.

I ended up running a continuous run at a much faster easy pace than normal when I was slowing down from a surge. If I just leave the continuous run for the next day after doing intervals only the day before, then I won't feel that same feeling of running at a slower pace after a very fast pace.

There are 2 parts to running, and one of the parts always gets neglected. People always go for the energy pathway workouts either running aerobically or anaerobically, but they don't pay attention to the feeling of impact. For example, Lance Armstrong has the stamina of a marathon runner but yet he can't even come close to running as fast as one because his legs are simply too weak to be able to handle the pace of an elite marathoner. What I'm saying is that if people give more importance to the legs just as they give to the heart and lungs, then training would be more effective. Of course that doing workouts that are meant for certain energy pathways will help adapt the legs to a faster pace anyways (like running 4x2000m @ 4:35 pace) but it's about taking that new exposure of running at a fast pace and applying it to a slower pace which will make the slower pace feel a lot easier than it would alone.
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My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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Angelo Z
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Joined: 11 Aug 2007
Posts: 1159
Location: LA, California

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just made a decision about marathon running. I want to start becoming a long distance runner after I reach my peak in the mile (3:39 mile). My parents have some friends and one of them is in his 40s and he runs marathons. He's from Guatemala too. Anyways, he invited me to run the NYC marathon with him, and the Charlotte Marathon that's coming up this November or December. I'm definitely looking forward to breaking 2:30 for the marathon because I've been doing 20 mile long runs during my base period that were a tiny bit faster than 2:30 marathon pace. It looks like I'll just move on from the mile on up. I'm convinced that the whole deal with African dominance isn't true. My country holds the second fastest mile record for women and my country also won gold at Beijing last year in the marathon for women too. I hope that I don't have to be 18 to register for the Charlotte Marathon like the NYC one requires.
_________________
My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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Angelo Z
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Joined: 11 Aug 2007
Posts: 1159
Location: LA, California

PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have noticed a unique running form by Bekele that makes him so fast. He has this high kick whenever he runs. He doesn't seem to run with such a wide stride like white runners do. I'm going to start doing drills that involve a ton of butt kicks. However, in order to completely change my running form, I have to run differently too. I'll exaggerate my kick especially at faster paces.
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My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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Dan
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Joined: 22 Mar 1999
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 19, 2009 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Exaggerating the butt kick portion of the stride accomplishes nothing other than making for wasted motion going on behind you... The knee lift is much more important. What you're seeing is a very fast and efficient recovery on the rearward part of the leg swing (think short lever arm, like with a figure skater pulling their arms in tighter and faster while spinning).

Dan
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Angelo Z
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Joined: 11 Aug 2007
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Location: LA, California

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 7:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What types of drills/exercises can I do then? I read about the high knee drill that it's just a byproduct of looking at sprinters and assuming that high knees is key. So if a figure skater pulls their arms in to spin faster, then that means that I'll automatically start improving the recovery of my rearward kick as I'm running faster? I've googled Bekele's stride and some person on some thread said that he was taught that way so I figured that I can do something to teach myself as well.
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My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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Dan
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Location: Salem, OR

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
then that means that I'll automatically start improving the recovery of my rearward kick as I'm running faster?

No, you've got it backward...

Dan
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Angelo Z
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Joined: 11 Aug 2007
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Location: LA, California

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 9:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So as I'm running faster, my rearward recovery with improve. However, if that is true, that means that I don't have to do anything else besides running faster. How come other athletes that run just as fast as Bekele don't appear to have that same rearward recovery? Does that mean that Bekele actually learned to do that? If so, what can I do to learn it too?
_________________
My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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Angelo Z
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Joined: 11 Aug 2007
Posts: 1159
Location: LA, California

PostPosted: Sun Sep 20, 2009 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok so a couple days ago I said that I'll start lifting weights again. However, I've made a few changes this time. I'll only workout my legs with weights, but I'll be using super heavy weights that will only allow me to go up to 5 reps. I saw on Hicham's training that he does squats of up to 16 reps+. I've done that before but I barely gained any strength, it was as if I was using the same weights every time. This time, I'm going for monster strength training only to see how it will help my running.
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My favorite all time race: Hicham El Guerrouj - Prefontaine Classic Mile 2002 http://youtube.com/watch?v=4YykUTHzOL8
•London 2012 XXX Olympiad•
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