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ben
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 Posted: Sat Sep 07, 2002 9:30 pm Post subject: toe running |
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| how injured do u get from training on ur toes? i wanna switch from 3200 to 800 in track and i don't wanna injure myself. i'm 16 and i wanna try that running a mile on my toes each day business to help with my sprint. |
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ben
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| Posted: Sat Sep 07, 2002 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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| i also know that there's a huge difference between college and high school bodies. can i really eventually learn how to stay on my toes for 800 meters if i work at it without killing myself? |
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Dan
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| Posted: Sat Sep 07, 2002 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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There's no reason to believe a high schooler cannot handle that sort of training. If anything, someone in their late teens is probably better able to handle physical strain than someone in their early 20's and still bounce back... What makes you think college athletes are better able to handle hard training? Something someone told you?
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ben
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| Posted: Sun Sep 08, 2002 8:01 pm Post subject: |
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high school runners still going through puberty have a hard time going through high density training. u can see it on any team. a runner that starts in his junior year is less likely to succuumb to injury than a runner that starts during his freshman year. the difference between 15 and 16 is pretty big. the difference between 15 and 21 is huge. how do u think all those college runners can take hundred mile weeks while the most any high schooler can take is 80 tops (if ur one of the best in the nation). sure, u build up to it, but there's no ignoring the difference in muscle composition and bone density u gain through puberty.
and yea, someone told me this. same guy that got me through my first track season without injury where u, on the other hand, seem to need help in that department. have u studied exercise physiology or are u just assuming some stuff from personal experiences? |
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Dan
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Location: Salem, OR
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| Posted: Sun Sep 08, 2002 8:17 pm Post subject: |
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You have a funny manner of asking for help... 
Let me ask you this rather rhetorical question: Have you been a collegiate runner yet? I have. I've also been a high school runner, and I've coached collegiate runners who have also been high school runners. I assure you I have some idea what I'm talking about. It's up to you if you want to believe me, but I find it very odd that you would ask for input (first directly to me by email) on a system I recommended and then imply I don't know what I'm talking about...
| Quote: | | high school runners still going through puberty have a hard time going through high density training. |
You've provided absolutely no evidence of that.
| Quote: | | u can see it on any team. a runner that starts in his junior year is less likely to succuumb to injury than a runner that starts during his freshman year. |
That has nothing to do with age and ability to handle high training loads. Look at your own statement. By your reasoning, if that same runner started training earlier, he would be able to handle the heavier load. His age and body's rate of physical maturation obviously are not going to be affected by his choice to start running earlier. All that changes is the body adapting to the exercise.
edit: Ok, now I'm confused... Looking back at what you wrote, I see you said the runner starting later is less likely to get injured, not more. Is that really what you meant to say? If so, then ignore my above response, because, quite simply, there is none. That's ludicrous!!!
| Quote: | | how do u think all those college runners can take hundred mile weeks while the most any high schooler can take is 80 tops (if ur one of the best in the nation). |
Another point you've failed to provide any evidence of...  There are lots of high schoolers who have handled high mileage (look at Joe Newton's system, for example), but what is debatable is how beneficial that is.
| Quote: | | same guy that got me through my first track season without injury where u, on the other hand, seem to need help in that department. |
That's such a weak and uninformed statement, I'm having a hard time not laughing. I could go into great detail about the numerous systems I've trained under and what effect they had on my injury status, or I could describe the 20+ hours per day I've spent in a neck brace for months on end because that's simply how my body is, similarly how I could barely walk for an entire summer in junior high because of knee problems before I had even taken up track, or I could tell you about the system I put into place for my sprinters last year with easily double the intensity of what they had previously and far less injuries as a result. However, I probably shouldn't waste my breath, because you've apparently already made up your mind to not trust the advice of the person you are asking for it from...
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Distance_Guru
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| Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2002 3:29 am Post subject: |
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Whoa!!!!
Lets get back to the original question
| Ben wrote: | | how injured do u get from training on ur toes? i wanna switch from 3200 to 800 in track and i don't wanna injure myself. i'm 16 and i wanna try that running a mile on my toes each day business to help with my sprint. |
Okay here is what you're looking at. As far as purely running on your toes the injury threat mainly lies in the calves and achilles tendons. Since running (particularly landing) on your toes puts a much greater strain on those area's than normal heel toe running. I recommend you don't try to just run on your toes on daily aerobic runs since biomechaniclly that isn't really the appropriate place to run on your toes. What I would do is three times a week in the offseason do some kind of interval training where you run at a pace that forces you onto your toes. You can also do strides, hill repeats and plyo's to get use to running up on the balls of your feet.
But I think the most important thing to remember is that you are trying to get faster not trying to run on your toes just for the sake of running on your toes. And you should train to take advantage of your bodies natural biomechanics to get faster, not try to change them without good cause. In other words if you train to run a fast 800 you will probably get up on your toes just fine without forcing the issue, which usually does lead to injury. So worry about running at a quick pace and you'll be much better off than if your worrying about whether your on your toes or not.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2002 4:23 am Post subject: |
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Now as for the volume training vs age issue. The amount you train is really all relative. I personally coach athletes that have trouble going over 40 miles a week and some that would be just fine at 100. And age has very little to do with it. It breaks down to a few different factors. First the indivduals expereince. Increasing mileage and intensity should be phased in over time. And that is true whether you're 12 or 21. Another is the individuals response to training. Certain people break down faster than others. The bodies ability to repair muscle and connective tissue damage from daily training and the athletes bone density are the two big factors that come to my mind. Biomechanics, certain issues with form can cause higher levels of strain on bone, muscle or connective tissue.
Now how do these factors relate to age. Well there are pluses and minuses to age. Lets start with someone in their mid teens (14-16 and remeber people mature at different rates so this is a ball park age). Athletes in this age range generally, repair quicker than say someone in their 20's from the muscular break down associated with training since their bodies are in high gear adding muscle mass and are pumping out large amounts of hormones that speed repair and growth. They also have greater elasticity in thier connective tissue which is key in preventing injuries. Where theur minuses fall is that younger athletes biomechanics generally aren't as good as older athletes (because their form has to constantly change to accomidate a growing body.) Also the bone density usually isn't as high in younger people since their bones are growing and thier growth plates haven't fused.
Older athletes generally have better biomechanics, and higher bone denstiy which helps prevent injury. But their muscles don't recover as fast and they may not have as much spring in thier connective tissue. Also older athletes are usually smarter in their response to injuries and understand what is happening and how best to deal with it. Although this trait isn't exclusive to older athletes it is more prevelent in expereinced athletes.
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Dan
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| Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2002 7:05 am Post subject: |
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DG ... always the voice of reason. 
Dan |
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| Posted: Mon Sep 09, 2002 8:18 am Post subject: |
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SSSSHHHHHH!!!!!!
Don't let that get out or you'll ruin my reputation.
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